Author Topic: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue  (Read 12117 times)

carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #180 on: 16 July 2020, 10:35:25 PM »
Sounds like you've got it.. I refer you back to Will's diagram, it's the valve on the line marked with a red dotted line. Just remove it and either blank the T pieces or replace with a new hose. That line is deleted in the later cars..

Sorry I take that back - it's the valve going to the intake isn't it..
That's odd because if that one has failed, it should only constitute a boost leak if the EVAP valve was open when you were on boost - which it shouldn't be! Has you EVAP failed too?

No I don't think so

What I have at the moment is a pipe that goes from the inlet manifold through to Connector R on the T7 valve with no restriction.

Because I don't understand the electronic boost control yet, I'm assuming that the pressure presented to the R connection helps to open the wastegate.

On the modified pipe removal, I do get that. I was thinking along similar lines, all that is needed is to allow the fuel tank gases to vent into the intake manifold, there's actually no need to feed them into the R port / cobra pipe.
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fka

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #181 on: 16 July 2020, 11:05:16 PM »
R is return and connected to the inlet (cobra) so there is only ever a negative pressure on that line. When the APC is bleeding pressure away from the actuator (W) from the compressor (C) - it goes to R and back into the inlet (cobra) to maintain measured air mass.

I can only assume that the line from the EVAP to the APC (actually to the cobra) is there so that if the EVAP valve is open under boost, it would still purge back into the inlet/cobra. But the EVAP valve "should" only ever open when there is a negative pressure at the intake manifold.. so it's pointless..
« Last Edit: 16 July 2020, 11:10:17 PM by fka »

carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #182 on: 17 July 2020, 08:22:02 AM »
Not cheap are they !

https://www.saabits.com/saab-original/saab-5322169-line

389.44

I'll have to ring Bill and see if he has an alternative solution, as I know he has the 3mm one way valves for vac lines. I think these are 10mm ??
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fka

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #183 on: 17 July 2020, 10:01:18 AM »
As long as you use fuel grade hose, can't you just cut and replace the line with the broken non-return valve, using an off the shelf valve?
Here's a pic of one I replaced on my 9-5 (06 so different setup). I used a working valve off some old line from my 9-3 and replaced the hard plastic hose with silicon..

fka

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #184 on: 17 July 2020, 10:04:55 AM »
Sorry the pic

fka

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #185 on: 17 July 2020, 10:14:14 AM »
And yes the hose I used isn't fuel grade  ::)

carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #186 on: 17 July 2020, 07:01:34 PM »
Couldn't get any valves locally and Bill didn;t have a solution so I ordered from ebay..... three arriving tomorrow if postie does his bit.

I did a 50 mile journey today. saw a bit over 1200 on Mreq, with 1178 on Mair, 1.1 bar boost showing. That seems rather good (with apologies to Phoenix)
« Last Edit: 17 July 2020, 11:18:24 PM by carrera »
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phoenix

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #187 on: 23 July 2020, 08:51:34 AM »
Without wanting to teach granny to suck eggs....

Have you enabled ECM Stat in Opensid ?

I thought this was giving the limit for Mair, but I just read something which says it says what is limiting Mreq

Useful links here https://www.trionictuning.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11688

I didn't need to for my diagnosis- I had Tech2 hooked up and the knock detect status was on.

carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #188 on: 24 July 2020, 03:37:16 PM »
Well, my one way valves finally turned up.... they had been sent RM48 not 24 anyway, but still nearly a week.

I bought three "10mm / 3/8 inch" aluminium one way valves. The EVAP side on the valve pulled off nice and easy, but the manifold side did not want to come off, it seemed to have melted onto the plastic valve and in the process shrunk on. There is a plastic inner layer on the pipe. That seemed to have separated from the rubber outer too.

Thinking about it, this makes sense. When the one way valve fails, the pipe gets exposed to inlet manifold temperature air, because it is flowing when the valve should be stopping it. I could not remove the old one way valve so cut the nozzle part off and drilled out the remainer until I had a clean pipe.

The one way valve was a reasonably snug fit on there, and the blow test in both directions had the right result,, so things were looking good. On the other side however, the pipe was larger and the valve just fell out.  ::)

I had been unsure whether to buy 12mm or 10mm valves. Next time I'll buy a 12mm, but for this repair I have simply used Sikaflex around the nozzle to fill the gap in the pipe and provide the seal. Not ideal, but I believe it will work - Sikaflex is resilient stuff.

That's going to need a day to go off properly, and then it will be time for a pipe swap

I'll put a picture up later

 
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carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #189 on: 24 July 2020, 04:16:04 PM »
Here's the photo, manifold to the right
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sgould

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #190 on: 24 July 2020, 05:33:02 PM »
I always assumed that the valve was heat-shrunk on, like the non-return valve on the 2004-on PCV system.  It was certainly well fixed when i looked when the car had done 10,000 miles.

Also, I think the pipe is harder plastic to prevent collapse if there's a vacuum, and the rubber cover is just to prevent damage.
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carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #191 on: 24 July 2020, 06:07:44 PM »
You could be right on the selection of materials, makes sense.

Anyway for those who are curious, here's the failure mode:

The one way valve is nothing more than a piece of rubber type material as a diaphragm, which is held in place by a small nipple which is pushed into the plastic housing.

When the nipple breaks off, the diaphragm is free to move about and air can bypass.

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carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #192 on: 28 July 2020, 08:57:51 PM »
I swapped the evap pipe over today for the one I had prepared Blue Peter style. Everything was reconnected, went out for a test drive and  :Fawlty: was confirmed by 1138 Mair on a quick 4th gear acceleration barely 500m from home.

I blew down the pipe I had removed, and, as  expected, confirmed exactly the same failure mode as the one I swapped.

Always good to have a spare on the shelf, as I will soon.

Having Opensid and knowing what the readings should be makes the diagnosis quite simple now

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sgould

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #193 on: 28 July 2020, 09:23:44 PM »
I did something similar last year.  I think I've cracked the rigid pipe because I get a strong smell of fuel from time to time.

But good to know that the EVAP leak causes these problems.
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carrera

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Re: Graphite Green 9-5 Aero rescue
« Reply #194 on: 02 August 2020, 09:03:36 AM »
I have now fixed the original EVAP pipe and now i know what to do it is really very easy.

1. Pull the valve out of the EVAP valve side of the pipe
2. Hacksaw off the nozzle on the manifold side
3. Run a 7.5mm drill up the nozzle remnant, increase to 8mm to clean the last bits out.
4. Push the replacement 10mm valve into the manifold side
5. Coat the open nozzle with Sikaflex, push the pipe into position, support the valve with something so that it is aligned properly for fitting in the car and wait 24 hours.

It probably takes as long to get the Sikaflex tube ready for use by removal of product that has gone off than to do the do the other mechanics.   
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