Cant Give it away! Stuff em!

[Audax]

If so, while washers might not have featured in the MOT in the past and therefore not caused a MOT fail, surely logic () dictates that under the new MOT rules then a car with Xenons must have (functioning) washers for an MOT pass?

Sorry If I didn't make it clear up there but yes, if your headlamp washers are non-functioning and you have Xenon lights then your car will fail the MOT (I believe, I'm not an MOT tester!), if there are none fitted as a way to get around the test then it should still fail. Effectively if your car came with washers from the factory they should work!

[Audax]

Wire the warning light circuit so it comes on with the ignition and goes off.

People have been doing this for years with ABS warning lights.

If the light does  not come on and go off in the sequence that is specified in the reference chart then it will fail, they are checking this. Over time there are plans currently being looked at where they will plug the car in and read any fault codes, some of these will then cause an MOT failure. Also, I can see many 9000's are going to end up killed off by this for SRS lights.

[Steve440]

They plug cars in to check for fault codes in some states in the US.

A good friend of mine who lives out there tells me many tales of cars failing with nothing wrong with them because codes have not been cleared. No free retest fee either

Steve

[CitTone]

....... isn't it the case that if a car has Xenons then it must also have washers?

I thought so, too, but there seems to be a whole bunch of (standard, small) cars out there that have HIDs without washers...basically because they don't have bumpers in which to mount them, it appears!

Mk2 Punto for example? If they have washers, I'm blowed if I can see where!

[Audax]

As far as I am aware then those cars don't meet type approval for use in the EU!  Of course I'm not an expert on vehicle type approval or small cars but it could be interesting come next year for people having their car MOT'ed.

[phoenix]

The DOT's view:

http://www2.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/drs/hidheadlamps.html

In summary, OEM fittings must have self leveling and washers. I think the washers much be pressure operated too, in order to avoid scratches from wipers causing glare.

@Steve440 have you had the fault codes read? It is veyr rare for a fault la,mp to illuminate without there being a fault in the the ECU.

[Steve440]

No I have not had it read but as everybody around where I live wants £££££ to get there Tech 2 out I have avoided that as they appear to be working OK.

Might have to start saving up if the car is going to fail its MOT next year though.

Steve

[BOF]

"A headlamp levelling or cleaning device inoperative or otherwise obviously defective" doesn't address a situation where there IS no levelling or cleaning device. It is true that cars fitted with xenons should have headlamp washers to comply with the Construction & Use Regulations, but in practice many do not, and still pass MoT tests (including mine, and I use a well-respected MoT testing station that has been in business for over 30 years).

The current MoT Testers Manual makes no mention of compliance with the Regulations on this point; nor does the new one. Logic doesn't come in to it...

I suspect that, in the absence of any supplementary amendments, if no headlamp washers (or, logically, (sorry) levelling devices)are fitted at all , they cannot be 'inoperative or otherwise obviously defective', and therefore be a reason for MoT failure. Common sense suggests they should be, but so does logic...

Fortunately, my headlamp levellers are fine (touch wood), and as all the pipework for the headlamp washers is still there, all I would need to comply with the Regs would be to fit washer jets that sprayed the headlamps and connect them up.

On the headlamp self-levelling issue, if SAAB do go down the tubes and the sensors are unavailable, there might then be a healthy market in retrofitting NON-xenon headlamp units. Corner the market while you can...

BOF (42 years of bodging) 

[Geoff1951]

Catch 22!

[Mr Linear]

I wonder would a set of static jets from a 9-3 SS be an easy retrofit?

You may even be able to get the right colour!

[pauljdh]

it always tickles me how a thread can get hijacked, taken off on a tangent to a completely different topic, thus losing the reaceability or easy recall for what is useful information for people in the future.

Should the moderators play a part on keeping order?

P

[sgould]

I take the view that all threads will degenerate.  I would only intervene if the first reply is irrelevant.  Once the question has been addressed, the thread is a chat among friends and they all go that way

[Geoff1951]

A sensible reply in all respects, and one that would apply to many posts . But I'd prefer to use the word "evolve" instead of "degenerate" 

[pauljdh]

Fair enough Sgould, I wasnt 100 pc sure of the conventions but still best to keep it hugging the main theme?

[Geoff1951]

...Anyone fancy a black Aero FSH going cheap?.............

Sorry Paul, I presume this is it?