Clutch issues

[Big H]

Evening.

MY54 9-3 1.9tid 120

I have a vibration coming through my clutch pedal for first 2-3 inches of pressing, which then clears, and returns when releasing the pedal at the same position. The vibration is accompanied by a rattling/scraping noise from the clutch. All gears seem to be engaging fine, and it only happens when engine is running. Depressing the pedal when engine is off, no vibration or noise.

I don't know if it is connected, but since the issue started, the car feels as though it is hesitating/choking when accelerating, and the car seems to be running rough. Also, when i turn the ignition off, there seems to be a hell of a judder from the engine.

There have been no problems with it until today, and it seems to have got progressively worse.

Any suggestions as to what it could be before i head to the garage in the morning would be handy. I'm fearing the worst though.

[Audax]

It sounds like the dual mass flywheel has failed, it gets noisy in just those circumstances and causes the vibration and running problems you're experiencing. You're looking at something like £1k to sort it as it's a new flywheel, clutch and associated labour. 

[Big H]

Thanks for that. Maybe a daft question, but if it is the flywheel that has failed, why does the clutch need replaced? Can i not just replace the flywheel.

Don't suppose you know what the part numbers would be?

Thanks again.

[Audax]

When the flywheel fails it takes the clutch with it. Part numbers vary, you can get aftermarket kits which are the same LUK (iirc) parts as Saab supply, it might save a bit of money, part number varies with engine number but the clutch kit is probably 93181953 and the flywheel is 93178364, you should also replace the flywheel bolts and get the crankshaft end flaot checked as if the main bearings are worn and there is play it means the replacement flywheel could fail quickly.

[Big H]

Thanks for the quick replies and info.

I'll try and be optimistic..... but not holding out much hope. Will let you know how i get on.

Cheers again.

[bignick]

Yeah, Sounds like the flywheel.

Apparently the flywheel, clutch plate and slave cylinder need to be replaced to keep the warranty on the parts or so I was told when mine was done.

I got the parts from GSF for about £400, they said at the time, due to the number of taxis using the Z19DT/DTH engine it keeps the costs down. Not sure if thats a good or bad thing though (shows how often they fail!!!).

Got the clutch fitted by my regular garage and just paid the labour. Could be a cheaper option for you.

[Big H]

Well, early doors visit to garage confirms it. It is the Flywheel, and recommended to replace the whole lot. They quoted 6 hours labour (apparently Saab say it should be 5, but mechanic said to give it an extra hour for unforseen hiccups) and to source the parts myself to keep the cost down. Seems reasonable.

bignick - will give GSF a go. Cheers

As a wee aside, the mechanic was doing the same job on a Renault this morning, and said that Renault suggest a full days labour because the subframe needs to be dropped.

Another wee aside, Audax and bignick, don't suppose you know the lottery numbers for this weekend, given you're talent for predicting the future?

Cheers again for the help.

[Audax]

Neo brothers appear to sell the genuine kit and clutch for about £425 (inc vat), doesn't include the flywheel bolts or the slave cylinder though.

How much does your garage charge for the labour? 6 hours is more reasonable than 5 hours for this job to be done properly too.

Also, I'm afraid that if I knew the lottery numbers I wouldn't be sharing as I need the money too, if I win I'll pay for your clutch and flywheel though 

[Big H]

I'll look out for you on the news with the lottery cheque!

Looked everywhere, including Neo (i normally use them) but managed to get LuK Clutch Kit (DMF, 3 piece clutch kit including slave cylinder) for £425 inc vat, 2 yr warranty and free delivery (should be here on monday) from Bellocat Products through "the bay." Should have been £447 but they gave me a discount when i phoned. If you don't ask, you don't get! Money's better in my pocket than theirs anyway. I know its not genuine Saab, but the local garage i use say they regularly use Luk products anyway.

They are charging £288 inc vat for labour. So including flywheel bolts and sundries should come in at under £750 total. Eases the pain a bit. But not much.

Out of interest, i was wondering how many times the DMF/clutch  fails in Saabs? I've done 118000, mostly motorway miles, and drive fairly conservatively (the majority of the time). There seems to be a fair amount of folk on here and other sites with the same issue. I have a friend who only ever drives Audi/VW and has never had any clutch problems.

[Audax]

DMF failure happens in loads of cars, Saab+Vauxhall, Ford, BMW, Audi and VW are notorious for it. It's not just a Saab problem, it's one of the reasons if I had a modern diesel it would be an automatic. Go and read the forums for these other cars and the situation is just as bad! 
 
The LUK kit is the same as the Saab item I believe, just doesn't come in a Saab box so you're doing well there, that's a good labour rate from the garage too.

[Big H]

At least it's not just us.

The garage i use is decent. Small but well run and know there stuff. As well good personal service.

Will let you know of the final outcome and standard of the parts/service/etc.

Cheers again
 

[bignick]

Hi,

No worries, I've had all the usual problems (clutch, manifold and egr) so been there and done it.

Glad you got sorted.

[Big H]

Well, car back in working order. 2 days later than planned and a few more pennies.

Grand total of £850 for all parts, sundries and labour. Extra labour charged for problems dropping sub frame and bleeding clutch. Not particularly chuffed with the extra, but kind of expected. I did think the initial quote was a bit on the light side. Still a fair bit cheaper than it could have been.

Parts were all there when delivered, although weren't delivered until Tuesday afternoon. Ordered them (a) because of the price and (b) because they promised they would be delivered on Monday (next working day delivery) and so booked the car in for Tuesday. Boy on 'phone claimed they weren't ordered in time, but did apologise when it was pointed out it was his mistake because they were, and so car was in garage for an extra day. And promised they would be here for 9am Tue. They didn't arrive until 3 pm. Not the best.

At least it's done, and feels like a new car.

Another bonus (ish). The other car (MY00 9-5 2.0t estate) passed it's MOT today without anything needed. Hopefully not see the inside of a garage for a good while now.

Cheers again for the replies.

[Max Headroom]

DMF failure happens in loads of cars, Saab+Vauxhall, Ford, BMW, Audi and VW are notorious for it....

 ...Go and read the forums for these other cars and the situation is just as

Yes! A driving examiner I met recently, used (I think) a Ford Focus as a training vehicle and he complained bitterly at the cost of DMF replacement.

Sometimes the old simple ways are by far the best.

[prestonsaab]

did the job on mine release bearing also flywheel did have play in it would advise to sort out soon as because this can cause problems to gear box and gears